Covenant & Conflict

In 1999, Wayne Wilks had a vision in a Budapest hotel room. Seventeen years later, on a balcony in that same city, he had another one... and it became Gateway Center for Israel.
Nic Lesmeister sits down with Wayne to trace the whole story: an altar in Amarillo where a missions call turned into a lifelong love for the Jewish people, a festival in Odessa that filled a new Bible institute with purpose, and a moment in Ethiopia that quietly pointed toward who'd carry it all forward. They walk through decades of open doors, prophetic words, and one visa that cleared as the plane was boarding.
What we cover in this episode:
Wayne's 1982 altar moment in Amarillo and the Ezekiel study that reframed "to the Jew first"
The 1996 Odessa festival and the Isaiah 37 visa story
Ethiopia's ancient Jewish community and Zimbabwe's Lemba tribe
The Ethiopia courtyard moment that pointed toward Nick
The Budapest balcony vision and the founding of Gateway Center for Israel

Chapters
0:00 Why Israel Is Key to Reaching the Nations
4:54 Wayne’s Call to Missions
9:31 A New Revelation About Israel
16:52 The Calling That Led to Ukraine
32:17 A Life-Changing Encounter in Ethiopia
48:47 The Birth of Gateway Center for Israel
59:03 What’s Next for the Church and Israel

"If you walk out those doors, you're not coming back home." She walked out anyway, and that was only the beginning.
On Covenant and Conflict, Trysten Tice tells David how a secular Jewish teenager from South Florida ended up asked to leave home for believing in Jesus, and what it cost her to keep going. She traces the years of persecution, the questions across the kitchen table, and the slow way her own family's hearts began to turn.
What we cover in this episode:
• Growing up culturally Reform Jewish, with faith as identity rather than belief
• The church service where she wept and couldn't explain why
• Praying "if Jesus is the truth, answer me" and watching her desires change
• Being told to leave home, and the friends who took her in
• Canceling her own baptism to honor her mother, then baptized in the Jordan River

Chapters
00:00 From Jewish to Following Jesus
01:55 Growing Up Jewish Without Knowing God
04:20 The Church Service That Changed Everything
09:41 How Reading the Bible Changed My Life
13:54 Kicked Out for Following Jesus
20:25 Baptized in the Jordan River
26:39 How My Entire Family Found Jesus

Does God still have a covenant with Israel? Is the Church the "new Israel"? And is every Christian who supports Israel automatically a dispensationalist?In this episode of the Covenant & Conflict Podcast, Nicholas Lesmeister and David unpack one of the most misunderstood topics in modern Christian theology. They explain what dispensational theology actually teaches, how it differs from Olive Tree theology, and why these distinctions matter for understanding Scripture.The conversation also explores the resurgence of antisemitism after October 7, the relationship between Israel and the Church, Romans 11, replacement theology, and why the Bible's story doesn't end with Israel being replaced—it ends with all nations being grafted into God's redemptive plan through Jesus.Whether you've wrestled with covenant theology, end-times prophecy, or simply want a more biblical framework for understanding Israel, this episode offers a thoughtful, nuanced conversation rooted in Scripture.Chapters:00:00 The Israel Test02:06 Why Antisemitism Is Rising Again15:07 What Is Dispensational Theology?26:26 Does God Still Have a Covenant with Israel?39:30 The Israel Test Explained43:45 Why Israel Changes Everything53:48 Why This Conversation Matters

What if joy wasn’t the absence of pain, but something deeper, stronger, and always available?
In this powerful episode of Covenant & Conflict, David Blease sits down with author and missionary Bonnie Saul Wilkes to explore a lifetime journey of calling, sacrifice, and discovering what true joy really is.
From growing up with a Jewish last name in a Christian home…
to encountering antisemitism that sparked a lifelong calling…
to living on a kibbutz in Israel and eventually moving to the former Soviet Union to disciple thousands.
Bonnie’s story is marked by bold obedience and unexpected turns.
But what stands out most isn’t just the mission… it’s the joy she found along the way.

In this conversation, Bonnie unpacks:
Why joy is not the same as happiness
How joy can coexist with suffering, loss, and uncertainty
The difference between joy, peace, and pleasure
Why gratitude is one of the most powerful spiritual practices
And how God leads us into joy through obedience, not comfort
Even through cancer diagnoses in her family, hardship in missions, and seasons of deep pain, she discovered that joy isn’t something you stumble into…
It’s something you walk into.
Her new book, A Roadmap to Joy, is the result of decades of journaling, poetry, and real-life encounters with God, and every story somehow leads back to one truth: Joy is always available in His presence.
Watch now and discover what it means to walk the pathway of joy.
00:00 – Intro: A Life Marked by Calling
02:15 – From Antisemitism to a Calling for the Jewish People
08:00 – Leaving Everything for the Nations (Soviet Union Missions)
13:11 – The Unexpected Theme: Why Every Story Led to Joy
19:50 – Joy vs Happiness: What Most People Get Wrong
30:55 – The Counterfeits of Joy (Pleasure, Success, Isolation)
35:15 – Joy vs Peace: How to “Soar Over the Chaos”
41:10 – A Final Prayer: Walking the Pathway of Joy

What happens when a Jewish man finds Yeshua, but refuses to stop being Jewish?
In this powerful episode of Covenant & Conflict, we sit down again with Rocket Rudolph, a Torah-observant Jewish follower of Jesus, to wrestle through one of the most misunderstood tensions in Christianity:
Can you follow Jesus and still remain Jewish?
What does “Torah observant” actually mean today?
Did the early Church unintentionally create division in Acts 15?
And why does the word “Christ” feel complicated for many Jewish followers of Yeshua.
This conversation goes far beyond theology, it’s about identity, calling, and the deeper story most believers have never been told.
From the meaning of Israel (“to wrestle with God”) to the real implications of Torah, exile, and Messiah, this episode challenges both Gentile Christians and Jewish believers to rethink what faithfulness really looks like.

Along the way, we unpack:
Why being “chosen” might not mean what you think
The difference between Jewish and Greek ways of thinking
How the gospel is often told… and what’s missing
Why antisemitism is ultimately a spiritual issue
And what it really means to live “through” Messiah

00:00 – Intro: The Jewish Wrestle Begins Again
02:15 – What Does It Mean to Be “Chosen”? (It’s Not What You Think)
08:10 – Torah Observance: Law, Identity, or Something Deeper?
15:30 – Acts 15: The Decision That Changed Everything
24:50 – “Christ” vs “Messiah”: Did Translation Shift Theology?
34:10 – Why Antisemitism Is More Than Political (It’s Spiritual)
45:20 – The Gospel We Preach vs The Gospel in Scripture
55:00 – Final Thought: Don’t Stop Wrestling